Author Topic: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock  (Read 3362 times)

mattnava

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #15 on: April 12, 2021, 02:23:28 PM
It's definitely a bit confusing! I suspect it has to do with the way that RGB color space works- It turns out that different hues actually have inherently different brightness values due to the color space being additive. I guess the value slider in an HSV model doesn't directly correlate to "perceived brightness," which is sometimes referred to as luminance. There's an 2 part article here that explains that phenomenon pretty clearly. Not sure if this a full answer to the question, but color space is definitely a nuanced thing! :)

https://medium.com/sketch-app-sources/mixing-colours-of-equal-luminance-part-1-41f69518d647
https://medium.com/sketch-app-sources/mixing-colours-of-equal-luminance-part-2-3e10c07c947c

An interesting detail in both the magic picker and infinite painter implementations is that when you change the hue, it actually does adjust both saturation and value to maintain the "perceptual" value. You can see that is happening because the reticle in the hue/value square auto-moves on both axes. (it can be seen happening in the vid I linked.)

Wouldn’t that mean when you turn the image to black and white, the values are still different? Bc the whole point of the luminosity lock, in contrast to what you described, is to keep the exact same value while shifting hues. That is to take chroma into account while painting, so you don’t mess with your contrasts. In the video you posted it looks like the values don’t actually stay the same, although I didn’t quite understand what the toggle does exactly from how it was explained. But I think the effect wouldn’t be the same, making it a different feature?

Lucky Clan

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #16 on: April 12, 2021, 03:48:40 PM
Question - do you think you will have to lock/unlock luminosity often? Or keep it locked all the time?
I’m asking because maybe a switch in Preferences is enough?

Moheri

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #17 on: April 12, 2021, 05:09:13 PM
Question - do you think you will have to lock/unlock luminosity often? Or keep it locked all the time?
I’m asking because maybe a switch in Preferences is enough?

Thanks for asking and making sure! Having it in the preferences wouldn't help, as it needs to be directly connected to the hsb color shifter. You need to be able to see how it changes the color if switched on  and immediately switch it off if need be, to maintain a continuous workflow while painting. Long story short: Yes, it's going to be used often.

Dorothyfan1

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #18 on: April 12, 2021, 09:02:07 PM
Don’t make this a preference setting. This MUST be a toggle on the color swatch itself. Because this is something that needs to be fine tuned constantly. There are times when this isn’t necessary so it’s a lot quicker to remove luminosity lock if it’s visibly available on the swatch itself rather than hunting for it in preferences.

Lucky Clan

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #19 on: April 13, 2021, 06:24:58 AM
Ok, thanks for your feedback

Bbolger

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #20 on: May 01, 2021, 01:50:39 PM
Don’t make this a preference setting. This MUST be a toggle on the color swatch itself. Because this is something that needs to be fine tuned constantly. There are times when this isn’t necessary so it’s a lot quicker to remove luminosity lock if it’s visibly available on the swatch itself rather than hunting for it in preferences.

+1
Exactly.
Very excited to see this coming to ASP

Lucky Clan

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #21 on: May 13, 2021, 07:02:10 AM
We have it implemented, ready for version 3.2. Beta version will be released very soon.

I'm only not sure how to show the "lock" indicator. Here is current version:

Moheri

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #22 on: May 13, 2021, 08:21:23 AM
WOW I'm so excited for this thank you!
As a user, I'm not sure how I would go about activating it judging from your screenshots of the controls there. I'd expect some kind of toggle to use in the color wheel window. But as an indicator that shows that it is currently active, the little sun icon on the wheel works well and gets the point across.

ggermain1

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #23 on: May 13, 2021, 08:32:53 AM
How long exactly until the 3.2 beta is released.

Lucky Clan

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #24 on: May 13, 2021, 08:41:00 AM
Next week.

How long exactly until the 3.2 beta is released.

mattnava

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #25 on: May 22, 2021, 05:56:19 AM
Hey luminosity lock is working great! I’d love to see the option be present on the hue slider in the color tool bar and also in the large square color picker, when hue mode is selected (when hue is isolated on the slider). I tend to use those color pickers more than the circle! It would be nice if it appeared on the handle anytime there is an isolated hue slider, really.

The ui seems like it’s probably a bit hard to discover naturally, since the handle looks similar to all others in its default state. I’m not sure what the best way to make it look like you can toggle the state of that hue handle just by looking at it... maybe a little lock icon inside it that switches between open and closed would signal the functionality clearly. Putting that in might be an easy way to make this function get a lot more use! I’ll try to do a mock-up when I have a moment.
Last Edit: May 22, 2021, 05:59:33 AM by mattnava

Moheri

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #26 on: May 22, 2021, 07:37:16 AM
Hey, it works for me also, most of the time. Although, I can sometimes provoke a bug when shifting the activated luminositiy lock often enough. The value gets lighter and lighter then with each shift. (I checked this by toggling the grayscale option in the reference view) I didn't manage to find the exact trigger of this behavior yet though, I'll keep an eye out.

mattnava

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #27 on: May 23, 2021, 11:17:02 PM
It seems that you can only toggle the state of the luminosity lock handle with a finger tap. It doesn't respond to tapping with an apple pencil, which made me think it wasn't working for a minute.

mattnava

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #28 on: May 24, 2021, 01:11:11 AM
I did a little mock up of a simple lock icon that changes state when you toggle luminosity lock on and off. The things I tried to make the design do were:
1 make both unlocked and locked states have the icon present to differentiate it from other slider handles and suggest in both states that it is tap-able (to help this feature be discoverable)
2 make the same icon work on all the different hue slider handle types (some are transparent, some are opaque, some are on thin bars, others are are on thicker bars)

This icon could be overlaid on the radiating lines that indicate the locked state in the current implementation, but I wasn't sure that those radiating lines would work well with the other thinner hue sliders because they might stick out. It is nice that they change the silhouette though, it might be worth adding to the others for that reason.

I tried changing the shape of the lock icon itself to be "open" in the unlocked state, but opted to just lower its opacity to illustrate the state change because of the constrained space available. I also considered putting a little "L" for luminosity on the lock, but thought it wasn't needed, wouldn't make sense in other languages potentially, and probably wouldn't look as clean.

I also played with darkening the area behind the icon for the locked state which did make it stand out more, but I felt it wasn't necessary and it was better to keep it lighter and let the color show through more.

I hope this is helpful/clear!

Moheri

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Re: Suggestion: Luminosity lock / Value and Saturation Lock
Reply #29 on: May 24, 2021, 01:38:38 AM
Cool mockups! Having the luminosity lock work on the hsb sliders aka shifting saturation while brightness adjusts automatically  to preserve luminosity would be awesome!